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Cimex Machine

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Post by milspec6 on Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:36 pm

Does anyone still find this dinosaur valuable in today's world? I have never owned one, but I see one local for sale. It sure ruled the realm a decade or so ago on commercial, but I don't know if it is still of value now that the CRB's are here.
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Post by Matt; My carpet cleaner on Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:15 pm

How much?

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Post by milspec6 on Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:40 pm

Looking at $1200
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Post by dp1 on Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:47 pm

Davey swore by that machine, that’s not bad of a price considering they are 3 grand new.
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Post by milspec6 on Wed Oct 18, 2017 7:16 pm

I have been looking for one for almost 6 years, but I am not sure if I would use it all that much now. I don't really encap any more so it would be mostly for dedicated scrubbing and hard floor usage.

Will have to think it over some more.
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Post by Mo on Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:32 am

If you're not going to use rhat much don't buy it especially if you're watching your pennies
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Post by milspec6 on Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:45 am

That has been my thoughts as well Mo. I keep seeing them and thinking that it looks like a very effective tool, but so is the Orbot and I rarely use that one either.

I sure wish there was a building that I could get away with encapping, I would love to shave off a ton of time and drop the sub payments, but it just wouldn't work out.
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Post by ACpower1 on Thu Oct 19, 2017 1:33 pm

I want one, they are the best imo for commercial encap. Where is Davey btw? is he still cleaning?
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Post by milspec6 on Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:42 pm

For those that have used one, how do you deploy it on commercial? Scrub and run or pad after?
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Post by Matt; My carpet cleaner on Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:00 pm

@milspec6 wrote:That has been my thoughts as well Mo.  I keep seeing them and thinking that it looks like a very effective tool, but so is the Orbot and I rarely use that one either.

I sure wish there was a building that I could get away with encapping, I would love to shave off a ton of time and drop the sub payments, but it just wouldn't work out.
Orbot work? How much and will you ship it?? Just asking.

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Post by milspec6 on Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:22 pm

@Matt; My carpet cleaner wrote:
@milspec6 wrote:That has been my thoughts as well Mo.  I keep seeing them and thinking that it looks like a very effective tool, but so is the Orbot and I rarely use that one either.

I sure wish there was a building that I could get away with encapping, I would love to shave off a ton of time and drop the sub payments, but it just wouldn't work out.
Orbot work? How much and will you ship it?? Just asking.

You are not the first to ask those question Matt. Razz

I tried to use the Orbot to encap one building at the Zoo using pads and bonnets....just too much crap on those carpets between all the gum, food, soda spills, and even baby's stool. HWE was the only option, but I do have another building that is always light soiling which I hate to clean with HWE as it is just a giant 200 x 65 foot wide open space that makes me lose my place constantly to where I end up cleaning sections 2-3 times before I am done.

The Orbot's motion would just be horrible over such a space, but a walk behind like a Cimex might be different story. I just don't think it would be very fast if I have to do a follow-up bonnet.
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Post by kleen1 on Sat Oct 21, 2017 6:54 am

I only encap commercial accounts when combined with initial HWE. Set up maintenance plan based on use and traffic. Many accounts are once a year HWE and encap the other 11 months.
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Post by milspec6 on Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:13 pm

@kleen1 wrote:I only encap commercial accounts when combined with initial HWE.  Set up maintenance plan based on use and traffic.  Many accounts are once a year HWE and encap the other 11 months.

I would love to be able to do that on some of those buildings, but the place gets over 2 million visitors per year so the foot traffic is crazy. Still, there are some buildings and areas that don't see that usage.

What is your method on the encap? What equipment?

I have only used encap for a couple of offices over the years that wanted monthly "touch ups" using the Orbot with pads and bonnets. After awhile it just seemed faster to wand it which is what I do now. Being able to save about 40 hours of TM usage a month by encap sounds great to me if I can decide how to approach it.
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Post by kleen1 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 5:09 am

I have two different sized cimex machines, a vario with buily in sprayer and a crb. the crb is a bit too light for really good cleaning, but it is lighter and gets in tighter areas, The vario, is oscillating pad machine, and to me seems the faster and more aggressive of the encap machines. The vario is usually the one I choose. The cimex is a machine I can go through how to use it with a new guy and have him working in 10 minutes. The cimex is a great machine, but because it is considered a rotary, the mills will say it voids the warranty. After speaking to people at the mills, it seems the crb and OP machines are acceptable.
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Post by dp1 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 9:30 am

Wow, I never heard cimex will void warranty, and that’s weird that they don’t consider crb and op machines rotary ? What about Rotovac or any rotary extractors ?

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Post by kleen1 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 12:18 pm

If it only goes round like a floor buffer, it's a no-no. I do know for a fact there is contradictory lab test results, so it would definitely be difficult to make stand up in court, but who wants to go through that nightmare.
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Post by milspec6 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 12:21 pm

I remember the warranty argument with the Cimex machine even though they proved that it didn't damage fibers even when left in one spot for an extended time.

I don't worry about warranty issues on commercial jobs. My only concern with encap is the, well, the encap process. It really is just about the appearance and not really full cleaning....sort of spreading out the soils and forcing them below the surface.

I realize that most commercial customers are just focused on the appearance and a cheap cost, but I am still a believer in that carpets need to be cleaned and flushed out for it to really be beneficial.

My sales program emphasizes that I clean to improve the appearance, the health, and extend the life of the material so encap doesn't really fit my image.

I guess I was just wishing for my cake and to eat it as well. I am going to stick with hwe, but I can sure see using an encap post hwe to even out some jobs or to deal with high wicking areas......that makes great sense to me.
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Post by kleen1 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:32 pm

Encap actually does remove soil if you are using a cryslallizer instead of a film former. The encap breaks the soil loose from the fiber, and the polymers crystallize around the dirt to be vacuumed away.
Supposedly film former encap solutions remove the soil to be vacuumed also, but I've tried both and find crystallizing encaps perform better.
That;s my story and I'm sticking to it.
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Post by kleen1 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:37 pm

I had one account, a restaurant that when cleaned by HWE left an awful smell. I know what causes it is still being too wet. This was cleaned by a company with a Vortex. I can't believe that monster still left the carpet that wet.
Well, we got the call, and the owner wnted to know if there was any alternative. We encapped for 3 years with a once a year HWE and he loved us.
Hated to see him change over to that new vinyl /wood flooring.
Still possible to get his entry area and bathroom tile.
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Post by milspec6 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:06 pm

A lot of companies over-wet, it isn't the machine but rather the skill that is lacking. I used a large company once to fill in for my normal sub and they left a swimming pool behind in their quest for speed. They finished in half the time that it normally takes, but the results were terrible and smelled like you described....their answer was to spray on a deodorizer. I never used them again.

There is soil removal in the post vac process or even in a bonnet, but it is still mainly at the surface in my opinion. It just leaves too much behind down near the backing for me to call it very "clean".

I know that many customers out there only want the appearance and would be thrilled with getting that for a much cheaper price, but I can't preach one thing and offer another...just bad business identity.

What do you think about the Cimex over-all? Good for hard floors and tiles compared to other tools? I do run into some large tile jobs where I run the Orbot and a CRB, but it looks like the Cimex might be easier to use and with greater weight.

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Post by dp1 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:24 pm

Well, I somewhat agree with Bob, cleaning techniques definitely matters, but I think cleaning all of the filters regularly is the key to not overwetting, equipment used is #2 in my list, that includes jet sizes, if you use vortex and use 16 flow jets and your filters are clogged, it doesn’t matter how well your technique is, you still are going to drench that carpet, even if you push down the wand on forward motion to squeeze the carpet.
I’m still shocked about the fact that cimex voids warranty, shocked that they don’t take carpet manufacturers to court to defend themselves, or maybe they did ?

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Post by milspec6 on Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:51 am

That is the nature of this industry, if you want to be accepted for warranty you have to pay. Just look at the CRI approval seal these days and see all the equipment that is now "approved" by the carpet mills.....the Rug Dr. being one of them.

Cimex is an old machine and was king of the hill for a long time, but I think the new toys wrote bigger checks. The Cimex shouldn't do any more damage than an Rx-20 would be able to do for example and it is still the belle of the ball in many circles.
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Post by Matt; My carpet cleaner on Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:17 pm

Warranties are worthless. Thier lawyers have worded the exclusions and blah, blah... To get out of 99% of the claims.
Heck, even by NOT placing new carpet in the place and allow to acclimate for afew days, to indoor climate....voided.

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Post by dp1 on Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:09 pm

Are you serious Matt ?
So Bob, are you saying there are politics being played in carpet industry ? laughing

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Post by milspec6 on Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:45 pm

Politics in the carpet industry? Of course not, it is a very honest industry. Razz
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