Is palm oil used in "green" plant based cleaners?

Does anyone know just exactly what these "green" cleaners are really made from? I want to know more than just... They are organic plant based. Thanks

Well I see some views but no responses. Oh well at least its being seen. Maybe someone will chime in soon.

I don't know about palm oil, but the question is not a simple one. There are not 2-3 compounds that comprise a "plant-based" cleaner, but a wide variety of potential ones.

I am no expert, but reviewing my MSDS of several organic cleaners, you find a lot of items: Pine oil, coconut diethanolamide, distillates, sodium gluconate from corn, glycerine for stability, oleic acid to fight foam, olive oil like in castile soaps, borax and baking soda, and limonene. This is certainly not an exhaustive list, but what I had in my storage.

Just look at a degreaser like "Simple Green" which lists its ingredients as primarlily water, alcohol, and sodium citrate...nothing fancy there, but a good general purpose cleaner that is plant based.

I know that I didn't really answer your question about what is really in there, nor do I know about palm oil, but the point being that there are a wide array of potential compounds in any "plant-based" cleaner.

Hopefully Joe will chime in here but here's my take

The problem with green cleaners is that OSHA doesn't require manufactures to list their ingredients if an hazardous ingredients compromise <1.0 of the that material or any carcinogenic ingredients that compromise >0.1. So if you look at an MSDS sheet and the ingredients aren't listed and it has a "0" health rating you probably cant get any greener than that.

Some of the ingredients that I have seen in green cleaners are Hydrogen Peroxide, Sodium Carbonate, Essential Oils.

There are also some cleaners that use micelle technology and are known as Colloidal Cleaners. Micelles is a cell that emulsifies oils and dirt. I know that Bonnet Pro and Vackaway use colloidal cleaners in their green products. Quantum Green from Vackaway uses a colloidal mixture of amino acids, fatty acids, corn oil, miscible salts.

Its  way to technical for me to explain but here is a video

Would it still be green if it meant removal of rain forest to plant palm farms?

Thank you milspec6 & mo for taking the time to give feedback.

Don't look at green as an absolute concept. For example I use an ETM and most electricity plants are powered by coal so that isn't completely green but it is greener that a gasoline powered TM. Now if my TM was connected to a bicycle and the power was generated by the bicycle it would completely green:D

As the other guys have said so well, there's literally thousands of surfactants and surfactant blends.
The best are proprietary. You don't spend $1,000s on R&D, then give it away.
For what it's worth, I never thought much of the palm derivatives.

The real Q is what's your purpose here Eco Joe?

If it's formulating, I'd discourage that. Too much work. Too many good ones already done.

If it's marketing, I teach this stuff all day. Keep it simple. DO NOT pretend to be a Chemist, Environmentalist, Ecologist, etc.

Just talk Safe.
Just talk about the DfE!
The DfE is the benchmark, the Pinnacle, the highest bar in safe cleaning standards. Period.


Practice this:
I wanted the safest cleaning agents for ME, my customers, their kids and their pets.
I went to the DfE for help.
You've heard of them right?
It's a branch of the EPA started back in the 90's ... their job was to find safer solvents for industry.
You know ... like the employees working in a paint or tire making factory. These people are around nasty chemicals all day and they needed safe solvents to get the stuff off their hands.
Nowadays the DfE is focused on finding safer products for consumers.
You're starting to see their logo pop up on laundry detergents and such.
FOR ME, I'm around chemicals all day, so I wanted the safest ones I could find. So I went the DfE.
They made it easy for all of us!
Now, all WE gotta do is look on the label.
Hang on ...I'll go get my favorite cleaner so you can see the DfE logo. OK?
Say all this with passion and watch their eyes.... if they light up, you are in buddy!

Now... just notice all the cleaners which claim to be Green... How many actually bear the DfE logo?
You guys could make a good living with nothing more than a big stopwatch and the DfE Logo on the side of your van.
Say, Safer for people, your pets and the environment.

Take the DfE safe cleaners and do your own comparative testing.
Pick one or two and go make your money.
I did.  The DfE was the single smartest thing I ever did in my little cleaning business.
It was like the key to all the Soccer Moms' hearts.
It's why I keep it going today - for you guys.

The DfE only 'Partners' with manufacturers who meet their stringent requirements.
Wanders Inc. is now a Partner.

Ironically, DfE Certification is FREE.
They only require their Partners provide 3rd party verification - of everything we do.
Each ingredient must pass the review as well as the complete formulations.
The R&D, the fees - $1600 for NSF Audit, yearly WoolSafe Testing & Certification, $1860, the special warehousing, packaging and Labeling - it all adds up.  
In the end, all we really get is permission to use the DfE Logo on our Labels and the words they allow in our advertising.
You guys should make the most of this privilege.

Speak of the DfE in your cleaning business and you will be better off for it.
Refer them to the DfE site. Show them the DfE Letter. Point at the Label. Show a little passion for the choices you made and those you recommend to your people.
I even wore the DfE Button (now sell it)... kinda feel silly 'til you meet the first person who actually cares about what's really safe for them, their families and their pets.
These people put Safe first, price last.
If I were you guys, I'd fire Angie and hire the DfE.

MOST IMPORTANT - ALWAYS OFFER TO LET THEM SMELL IT.
It's like saying, I have nothing to hide here.
If they say OK, run get it, and let them.
They'll probably say "hmmmm, ok,"
Dude, YOU ARE IN !



A bunch more guys being added to the list of Pros Who Clean Safely:


STAN GILLIAM

STAN GILLIAM SERVICES

SEQUIM, WA

360 460-2100

stangilliamservices@yahoo.com





JOSEPH CORCORAN

KLEENING MADE AFFORDABLE

OXFORD, PA

302 588-0901

joseph@kleeningmadeaffordable.com





ROBERT

PREMIER CARPET CLEANING


COLORADO SPRINGS, CO

719 440-8123

Robert@thepremierclean.com



DAVE TRAGER

FIRST CHOICE GREEN CLEAN

LONG BEACH, CA

562 547-4147

mobileidt@gmail.com



RICK PAYNE

GREAT CHOICE CARPET
HIDDEN VALLEY LAKE, CA

707 809-7082

Greatchoice.cc@gmail.com





BEN SURDI

PURE CLEAN

WOODINVILLE, WA

206 579-0043,

bensurdi@gmail.com




ROBERT HUKEE

BOB’S CARPET CARE

SUMMERVILLE, SC

616 970-1237

rehukee@gmail.com




JAMES WILKINSON

J.W. SERVICES

FREEMONT, IN

260 687-7450

Jvwilkinson74@gmail.com




MATT & MICHELLE

MY CARPET CLEANER

YAKIMA, WA

509 966-6505

Mmthornton6@gmail.com




PIERRE BONATO

DELTA, BRITISH COLUMBIA

604 940-9222

bona.park@hotmail.com

when I go to KFC I ask for the secret  11 herbs and spices

Hey I want in that list.  

Glad to see I made the list, but I'm not sure how?
Was it the chems I bought and use from you, Joe?

Hey and I also want a button! ....do I just need to order it from you? 
I don't really want to 'wear' a button lol, but I will to show what I'm about, caring for the best interest of my customers and their property they trust me to to clean.

Short anser = nonionic surfactants + oil mixture of choice.

Castile or Vegetable-Oil Based Liquid Soap: An effective cleaning agent that
biodegrades quickly and is found in the cleaner section or health stores. Plant
based dishsoap may be substituted, but only use half the amount.
+
oil = cleaner

https://wmeac.org/media/files/global/GREENCLEANGUIDE.pdf

Joe can u put a link to my website on that list.

thepremierclean.com

Thx

Joe Bristor wrote:As the other guys have said so well, there's literally thousands of surfactants and surfactant blends.
The best are proprietary. You don't spend $1,000s on R&D, then give it away.
For what it's worth, I never thought much of the palm derivatives.

The real Q is what's your purpose here Eco Joe?

I understand proprietary procedure & ingredients. It's my concern of palm oil being used to make the surfactant that's used in it. I hope not to offend from my question. I feel it's only fair be able to ask about what the stuff i'm using is made of. My customers ask me a lot of the time. Shouldn't I give a straight to the point answer?

How about when they ask ... what the stuff i'm using is made of. My customers ask me a lot of the time. Shouldn't I give a straight to the point answer?"
you say ... Well, you know I wondered about it too. After all, I'm EcoPro of Beaumont. So I went to the manufacturer. And here's what I learned..."

What did they teach you Joe?
Did they help you answer your customers Qs?

If not then how about the truth... they weren't much help, so I went to my local carpet cleaner's forum for help.
One guy kept harping on the DfE so I followed his advise and tested some of the DfE products. Eventually, I switched to an all DfE safe product line.
This way I don't have to pretend to know what's in the stuff I use; it's already been checked out!
Wait a minute and I'll go get the container and let you smell it. OK?
I'm part of the group of real cleaners who promote only the safest cleaning agents.
Check me out at xyz


What's wrong with this plan Joe?

Sorry Joe I think I misunderstood your question. What carpet cleaning products have you used that contain palm oil that way I can avoid it.

For the guests reading this post , here is the letter Joe B is talking about. I also attached it as a PDF file

I'm confused. But I want that letter linked to my company!

Here you go Ryan, http://www.realcleaners.com/DfE%20Letter,%202012.pdf

Thanks Larry